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I Only Post Everything
Registered: 02/26/2009
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

arne wrote:

We don't try or want to compete with the gorilla in our room, nor are we trying to steal away fans. Sorry if you don't agree with the update, but that wasn't our reasons for making any changes, which were a long time in the works, relatively speaking.
Our game has done more than well enough on it's own you know.
We felt the game could progress, and that's what we keep setting out to do.  

Arne, the alterations made to the game with 1.05 distinctly resemble Modern Warfare. Certainly you saw the player levels drop once MW2 was released. Are you saying that no one at ND even considered that you might be able to tap into that 20 million-man market by accommodating them with higher weapon damage, a more casual competitive environment, and aesthetic pleasures like the new in-your-face medal notifications, or do you mean that those weren't your primary reasons?

 

I'm having difficulty imagining a scenario where a game that does "more than well enough on its own" undergoes an overhaul that drastically unbalances its competitive multiplayer solely in the name of progress. Surely there's a reason it did that well in its previous form (or not really as well as you'd hoped as the case may be). As others have mentioned, we're well into the game's competitive lifetime, and any fundamental changes should have been implemented in the beta period, not after Modern Warfare 2 swept in and stole away the online population. I can certainly understand the desire to have your game played by more people - you all deserve that - but 1.05 is a cheap knock-off that removes or limits what made Uncharted your unique creation.

 

I know you weren't with ND for this period, but what you're saying now is akin to ND circa 2002 claiming that Jak II isn't trying to compete with the contemporary king - GTA, isn't trying to steal away its fans etc. after creating a platforming foundation for the franchise in Jak & Daxter. 

Message Edited by Bioshock on 02-25-2010 12:13 AM
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Naughty Dog Developer
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

Bioshock wrote:

Arne, the alterations made to the game with 1.05 distinctly resemble Modern Warfare. Certainly you saw the player levels drop once MW2 was released. Are you saying that no one at ND even considered that you might be able to tap into that 20 million-man market by accommodating them with higher weapon damage, a more casual competitive environment, and aesthetic pleasures like the new in-your-face medal notifications, or do you mean that those weren't your primary reasons?

 

I'm having difficulty imagining a scenario where a game that does "more than well enough on its own" undergoes an overhaul that drastically unbalances its competitive multiplayer solely in the name of progress. Surely there's a reason it did that well in its previous form (or not really as well as you'd hoped as the case may be). As others have mentioned, we're well into the game's competitive lifetime, and any fundamental changes should have been implemented in the beta period, not after Modern Warfare 2 swept in and stole away the online population. I can certainly understand the desire to have your game played by more people - you all deserve that - but 1.05 is a cheap knock-off that removes or limits what made Uncharted your unique creation.

 

I know you weren't with ND for this period, but what you're saying now is akin to ND circa 2002 claiming that Jak II isn't trying to compete with the contemporary king - GTA, isn't trying to steal away its fans etc. after creating a platforming foundation for the franchise in Jak & Daxter. 

Message Edited by Bioshock on 02-25-2010 12:13 AM

 
Of course any change is going to resemble any other game out there -- everyone needs to find a common item "x" that they can provide as an example so that others implicitly understand their point. But we're definitely not trying to emulate MW/MW2. We're not trying to compete with them -- they've created an extraordinary game that has it's own hooks and appeal. The best strategy for us, as it's always been, is to focus on our instincts, our expertise and create our game the way we feel is great, the way we want to (including community feedback and gameplay feedback). We can always learn from what others do well, but we've laid out the path we want to head and while we'll make some course corrections, we're not going to wholesale deviate from it. that's the wrong strategy to take and will not end well. 
 
We don't react (or panic) due to some other game being released, last year or this year. Again, that's the wrong mentality to take and will ultimately lead to a weaker game. We just need to continue to trust ourselves and stick to our plan. Whether or not the TU1.05 adjustments are altered, tuned or removed has nothing to do with any other game or competitor out there. It has to do with us standing by what we think is best for our game to ultimately make it a fun, satisfying experience.
 
 
 
 

 

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Sackboy
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010
dont sweat it with the 1.05 whine-fest Arne, everyone here complains about it because they cant go running around with the shotgun killing everyone anymore, now they need to actually use some tactics, and other weapons. 
jor21
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Sackboy
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010
I'm pleased that Naughty Dog is so integrated with their community that they will not only release DLC and attempt to improve gameplay for the majority of players, but talk with fans on various forums.

While I don't expect developers to go so far as ask for our thoughts, I think we can assume that they are taking notes.  To the community I say ditch the quoting of points people said or referring to previous events to prove your point and just suggest what should be fixed.

Frankly this game hasn't been out long enough for this much fan division, no matter the level a player.  I know I want both the opinion of someone who has put a lot of time in and someone relatively new without anything to say but if it is fun.  Just give your thoughts on what should be fixed, but think about why it should be changed and why it might have been put in before posting.
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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

jor21 wrote:
dont sweat it with the 1.05 whine-fest Arne, everyone here complains about it because they cant go running around with the shotgun killing everyone anymore, now they need to actually use some tactics, and other weapons. 

kudos to you, sir.

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Fender Bender
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

arne wrote:
Of course any change is going to resemble any other game out there -- everyone needs to find a common item "x" that they can provide as an example so that others implicitly understand their point. But we're definitely not trying to emulate MW/MW2. We're not trying to compete with them -- they've created an extraordinary game that has it's own hooks and appeal. The best strategy for us, as it's always been, is to focus on our instincts, our expertise and create our game the way we feel is great, the way we want to (including community feedback and gameplay feedback). We can always learn from what others do well, but we've laid out the path we want to head and while we'll make some course corrections, we're not going to wholesale deviate from it. that's the wrong strategy to take and will not end well. 
 
We don't react (or panic) due to some other game being released, last year or this year. Again, that's the wrong mentality to take and will ultimately lead to a weaker game. We just need to continue to trust ourselves and stick to our plan. Whether or not the TU1.05 adjustments are altered, tuned or removed has nothing to do with any other game or competitor out there. It has to do with us standing by what we think is best for our game to ultimately make it a fun, satisfying experience.

 

So you are not ruling out the possibility of changing things like certain weapon's damages, the hitboxes, or the spawns? 

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Uncharted Territory
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

tripleWRECK wrote:

arne wrote:
Of course any change is going to resemble any other game out there -- everyone needs to find a common item "x" that they can provide as an example so that others implicitly understand their point. But we're definitely not trying to emulate MW/MW2. We're not trying to compete with them -- they've created an extraordinary game that has it's own hooks and appeal. The best strategy for us, as it's always been, is to focus on our instincts, our expertise and create our game the way we feel is great, the way we want to (including community feedback and gameplay feedback). We can always learn from what others do well, but we've laid out the path we want to head and while we'll make some course corrections, we're not going to wholesale deviate from it. that's the wrong strategy to take and will not end well. 
 
We don't react (or panic) due to some other game being released, last year or this year. Again, that's the wrong mentality to take and will ultimately lead to a weaker game. We just need to continue to trust ourselves and stick to our plan. Whether or not the TU1.05 adjustments are altered, tuned or removed has nothing to do with any other game or competitor out there. It has to do with us standing by what we think is best for our game to ultimately make it a fun, satisfying experience.

 

So you are not ruling out the possibility of changing things like certain weapon's damages, the hitboxes, or the spawns? 


They never have. They just said the would wait and see for a while, and make a decision "when the dust settles" and after more testing.

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Sackboy
Registered: 03/29/2009
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010

arne wrote:

Bioshock wrote:

Arne, the alterations made to the game with 1.05 distinctly resemble Modern Warfare. Certainly you saw the player levels drop once MW2 was released. Are you saying that no one at ND even considered that you might be able to tap into that 20 million-man market by accommodating them with higher weapon damage, a more casual competitive environment, and aesthetic pleasures like the new in-your-face medal notifications, or do you mean that those weren't your primary reasons?

 

I'm having difficulty imagining a scenario where a game that does "more than well enough on its own" undergoes an overhaul that drastically unbalances its competitive multiplayer solely in the name of progress. Surely there's a reason it did that well in its previous form (or not really as well as you'd hoped as the case may be). As others have mentioned, we're well into the game's competitive lifetime, and any fundamental changes should have been implemented in the beta period, not after Modern Warfare 2 swept in and stole away the online population. I can certainly understand the desire to have your game played by more people - you all deserve that - but 1.05 is a cheap knock-off that removes or limits what made Uncharted your unique creation.

 

I know you weren't with ND for this period, but what you're saying now is akin to ND circa 2002 claiming that Jak II isn't trying to compete with the contemporary king - GTA, isn't trying to steal away its fans etc. after creating a platforming foundation for the franchise in Jak & Daxter. 

Message Edited by Bioshock on 02-25-2010 12:13 AM

 
Of course any change is going to resemble any other game out there -- everyone needs to find a common item "x" that they can provide as an example so that others implicitly understand their point. But we're definitely not trying to emulate MW/MW2. We're not trying to compete with them -- they've created an extraordinary game that has it's own hooks and appeal. The best strategy for us, as it's always been, is to focus on our instincts, our expertise and create our game the way we feel is great, the way we want to (including community feedback and gameplay feedback). We can always learn from what others do well, but we've laid out the path we want to head and while we'll make some course corrections, we're not going to wholesale deviate from it. that's the wrong strategy to take and will not end well. 
 
We don't react (or panic) due to some other game being released, last year or this year. Again, that's the wrong mentality to take and will ultimately lead to a weaker game. We just need to continue to trust ourselves and stick to our plan. Whether or not the TU1.05 adjustments are altered, tuned or removed has nothing to do with any other game or competitor out there. It has to do with us standing by what we think is best for our game to ultimately make it a fun, satisfying experience.
 
 
 
 

 


best for our game to ultimately make it a fun, satisfying experience.***IMO update 1.05 didn't make the game fun, and a satisfying experience, Update 1.04 did that. 1.05 has made the game frustraiting to play.
elsencillo

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Get Some facts

Feb 25, 2010
And IMO update 1.05 made the game extremely fun. You see, opinions, much like sphincters, are common to everyone. The best we all can do now is sit back and enjoy the new DLC and if you can't enjoy competetive, then go play some co-op with the new maps.
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