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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

TimeWarnerSux wrote:

OldManRaven wrote:
Did you read the thread? It's been stated by a NAUGHTY DOG EMPLOYEE that it IS affected.

Not to mention if the entire team has crafter three, and can craft a bunch of stuff, they can easily top off their molotov collection with a few boxes. I don't agree with limiting their ingredients, or making them harder to craft, this makes them a priority and everything else secondary, of which they already are.

If you're not **bleep** about molotovs, it's because you haven't been exposed to a bomb match yet. If you don't know what that is, you'll know it when you see it.

I did read that ND said it is affected.  But no one knows for sure if they died because EE2 expanded radius or if it was lag.  In other words, do people know for sure they wouldn't have died if EE2 wasn't equipped?  I've toasted 4 people with a Moltov and 3 a handful of times and I didn't have EE2 equipped (not sure if I had EE1 equipped).

 

When I use Moltovs it seems to be inconsistent.  Sometimes I'm surprised I toast people with a Moltov when they aren't even close.  Sometimes I throw the Moltov right on them and they didn't die. 

 

There are too many factors to know whether or not EE1 or EE2 expanded radius actually helped in the kill or not.  Lag and inconsistency and no cinema replay.  No one can say for sure if EE helped in the kill.

 

 



_
Coincidently "Molotov Dodgeball" started right after EE2 was put in the game. Molotovs definitely need to not be affected by EE2, it is crazy.

 

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Monster Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013
Because its the norm for someone to deploy a mine and sit on it...
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

TimeWarnerSux wrote:

OldManRaven wrote:
Did you read the thread? It's been stated by a NAUGHTY DOG EMPLOYEE that it IS affected.

Not to mention if the entire team has crafter three, and can craft a bunch of stuff, they can easily top off their molotov collection with a few boxes. I don't agree with limiting their ingredients, or making them harder to craft, this makes them a priority and everything else secondary, of which they already are.

If you're not **bleep** about molotovs, it's because you haven't been exposed to a bomb match yet. If you don't know what that is, you'll know it when you see it.

I did read that ND said it is affected.  But no one knows for sure if they died because EE2 expanded radius or if it was lag. 

 

There are too many factors to know whether or not EE1 or EE2 expanded radius actually helped in the kill or not.  Lag and inconsistency and no cinema replay.  No one can say for sure if EE helped in the kill.

 

 


 

Wait... That's even worse. Oh dear god. 

Ho Ho Ha Ha
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

I did some testing in a custom match:

 

Normal Molotov Range

IMG_2918.JPG

 

With EE2

IMG_2919.JPG

 

From this distance with EE2, it took off my armor and no health damage (keep in mind you lunge forward a little when throwing them so I'm slightly closer when hit)

IMG_2920.JPG

 

Same distance with EE2 and full health, it took out half of my health

IMG_2921.JPG

 

I also noticed that when aiming them at spaces where the floor meets a wall, you can notice the 3D spherical radius of it, but it seems to have a greater effect when thrown at say a wall than the floor next to someone. If you are in that circle or at the edge of it when it lands though, you will be instantly killed. Anything else is lag.

 

My conclusion, EE2 is really frickin strong. 

 

Either change EE to:

 

A) It doesn't effect Molotovs

 

B) 1. See Bombs 25% farther away in Listen Mode and increase bomb explosive radius by 15%.

     2. See Bombs 50% farther away in Listen Mode and increase bomb explosive radius by 30%

 

C) Some other combination where you can't have Molotov with 50% increased radius.

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Treasure Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

xSKIN_N_BONESx wrote:

I did some testing in a custom match:

 

Normal Molotov Range

IMG_2918.JPG

 

With EE2

IMG_2919.JPG

 

From this distance with EE2, it took off my armor and no health damage (keep in mind you lunge forward a little when throwing them so I'm slightly closer when hit)

IMG_2920.JPG

 

Same distance with EE2 and full health, it took out half of my health

IMG_2921.JPG

 

I also noticed that when aiming them at spaces where the floor meets a wall, you can notice the 3D spherical radius of it, but it seems to have a greater effect when thrown at say a wall than the floor next to someone. If you are in that circle or at the edge of it when it lands though, you will be instantly killed. Anything else is lag.

 

My conclusion, EE2 is really frickin strong. 

 

Either change EE to:

 

A) It doesn't effect Molotovs

 

B) 1. See Bombs 25% farther away in Listen Mode and increase bomb explosive radius by 15%.

     2. See Bombs 50% farther away in Listen Mode and increase bomb explosive radius by 30%

 

C) Some other combination where you can't have Molotov with 50% increased radius.


Have a kudo for that work.

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Treasure Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

SouthpawLP wrote:


Have a kudo for that work.


Honestly surprised no one else did anything similar yet. The Molotov is the easiest one to check because it's reticle actually shows it's radius.

 

Testing a bomb would be much harder because they roll, bounce, have a slight timer delay, etc. While I was in there though I also tried to commit suicide or damage myself with a smoke bomb. Couldn't do it. I even tried sprinting away like when it downs me in actual matches but that didn't work either.

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Treasure Hunter
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

[ Edited ]
Jul 7, 2013

Thanks xSKIN_N_BONESx for the testing and clarification.

 

If that's the case, I would really appreciate either: A) Molotovs unaffected by Explosion Expert or B) Level 1 increases radius by 15% and Level 2 by 30%, that sounds a reasonable change which would (hopefully) solve this issue.




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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

xSKIN_N_BONESx wrote:

SouthpawLP wrote:


Have a kudo for that work.


Honestly surprised no one else did anything similar yet. The Molotov is the easiest one to check because it's reticle actually shows it's radius.

 

Testing a bomb would be much harder because they roll, bounce, have a slight timer delay, etc. While I was in there though I also tried to commit suicide or damage myself with a smoke bomb. Couldn't do it. I even tried sprinting away like when it downs me in actual matches but that didn't work either.


I've used Explosive Expert 2 a couple times (SUE ME!) and honestly when I arc-aimed the Molotovs, I couldn't notice the difference. Seeing side-by-side photos though definitely did help me see it. Thanks!

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

[ Edited ]
Jul 7, 2013

It's a powerful weapon with an even more powerful perk to make it overpowered. It's like carrying around three nail bats.

The weapon itself is inconsistant, with the EE perks it make an inconsistant weapon even more inconsistant. I can tell you this, without EE, which I never use, I have to hit someone directly with a molotov to kill them, if they're wearing armor, it takes two molotovs if they aren't hit directly, which even then isn't always true with armor, and are closer to the center. The radius for it is tiny in my personal experience, so for people throwing it nowhere near me and killing me, they'd have to be using a radius booster.

This doesn't even cover for the nail bomb's exploits, which if you didn't know is limited to fools standing over their own bombs waiting for you to attack them. I think bombs should be friendly fire enabled in general, it ain't right that you can stand next to the things and not take damage as long as someone else sets it off, not counting floor traps and things like that, I mean hide in a room and put it around the corner.  This is pretty much a garunteed down but does not affect the enemy. Same goes for throwing molotovs at downed teammates which I've done plenty of times, sure it kills everything around them, but I find it jarring. This isn't counting the folks who have the bombs visible, you can just shoot them in that case, I'm also pretty sure if someone has a molotov in hand you can shoot that too.

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Re: molotov + explosives expert = broken game

Jul 7, 2013

OldManRaven wrote:
It's a powerful weapon with an even more powerful perk to make it overpowered. It's like carrying around three nail bats.

The weapon itself is inconsistant, with the EE perks it make an inconsistant weapon even more inconsistant. I can tell you this, without EE, which I never use, I have to hit someone directly with a molotov to kill them, if they're wearing armor, it takes two molotovs. The radius for it is tiny in my personal experience, so for people throwing it nowhere near me and killing me, they'd have to be using a radius booster.

This doesn't even cover for the nail bomb's exploits, which if you didn't know is limited to fools standing over their own bombs waiting for you to attack them. I think bombs should be friendly fire enabled in general, it ain't right that you can stand next to the things and not take damage as long as someone else sets it off. Same goes for throwing molotovs at downed teammates, sure it kills everything around them, but I find it jarring. This isn't counting the folks who have the bombs visible, you can just shoot them in that case, I'm also pretty sure if someone has a molotov in hand you can shoot that too.

You can one hit kill people that have armor and full health with a single molotov. I've done it multiple times and had it done to me multiple times.

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