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Monster Hunter
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

Jun 9, 2013

Why should I not lend games to friends? I lend other products I purchase to friends. I also try new games I would never have tried by borrowing them. An example is Dragon Age. I was staying away from it since I thought it was just a was for EA to stay within the fantasy genre after loosing the D&D lisence. A friend lent me DA: Origens and I loved it. Went out and purchased the legendary edition so I could have the all the DLC with the game and preordered DA2. I'm probubly one of the few who actually really enjoyed DA2 and purchased tall the DLC that was released.

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VP of Gaming
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

[ Edited ]
Jun 9, 2013

brigantine_72 wrote:

While I get your issues with the car example I think it still works. My guess is the "gamer logic” comment is an insult so I’m hoping we can keep the discussion friendly. We can disagree without the typical game forum insults. I can lend a car to a friend, family member or wife with no restrictions.   When you purchase something it is yours to pretty much do as you want. Yes companies can and should try to keep you as a customer but that is not the same as making you a customer. Using the car example can purchase aftermarket products or company approved products. Yes your trade in value may be higher with company approved parts but you can still get whatever one you want.

 

(I say "gamer logic" because it's a thought process that doesn't seem to exist anywhere else. The other thing about aftermarket parts, yes you can buy them from Bosch and from Auto Zone's Duralast brand, but who do you think LICENSES the rights to make those parts? If the parts are not authorized, it has to be clearly stated as being such. If you go to IPDUSA's website (who make Volvo custom parts) it clearly states that they are not affiliated with the Volvo Car Corporation or with Geely Holdings. You can lend a car to someone, however if they crack it up in a crash, you're still on the hook for repairs and god forbid if you injure somenoe because it's still registered in your name, and you can be subject to prosecution arrest, and lawsuits becasue of it. There are a myriad of criminal negligence laws you have to consider. If you finance the car, it's "yours" however if you miss a payment it won't be for very long, and don't miss any tax payments or you'll find a boot on the car. Again, "gamers" don't seem that well versed in automotive matters. )

 

I don’t think the PC example of DRM is valid for two reasons. PC has major piracy issues that consoles don’t have as bad and DRM systems such as Steam pass along savings by the deals they have. I don’t mind not being able to trade or loan games on PC because the deals I get on Steam make up for it. This is give and take and both parties win. This is not the case with consoles in my experience and unless they announce something radical I don’t see it changing. And again I want to state my console digital download experience is strictly XBLive so Sony may have a vastly different pricing system.

 

In any case my point is I’m hoping Sony decides to go in a more consumer friendly manner with the PS4.

 

("Consumer friendly" or entitlement natured? Because all this yelling and screaming always seems contingent on the industry being a one way street, and that the people who actually make the games do not have the right to make money from their hard work. It's always the same song and dance, and it always seems to come back to "this is different because it's video games". It's not different, it's a BUSINESS like any other. And in business, people have the right to make money.)


 

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

Jun 9, 2013

@balmungfury

Bro no need for the hate, nowhere did I even insult console gamers.  DrM is a developer/publisher issue anyway and not Sonies problem. Sorry but if DRM is the way to keep the money going where it should go that's how it needs to be,  you just don't understand what "The right thing to do means".  Call me sheep man doesn't bother me. 

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Monster Hunter
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

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Jun 9, 2013

Financing and insurance are different issues. If you’re financing, at least through the car dealership, you don't "own" the car in the same way as paying full price for a video game. Insurance is what it is and I always get the option to have other drivers insured while driving my car. You are still able to take on the risk and lend your car.

 

Expecting to be treated well by a company is not entitlement. I don't pirate games and I don't expect be treated like I do. DRM can and has been implemented well with Steam. Both the creator and consumer benefit. The consumer gives up some options (resale, lending) while gaining better pricing and creators loose a little on the profit margin but gain happy customers. If this was the system XBLive or PSN implemented their new policies I would be fine with it. I do not know what the PS4’s policies will be and XBone’s seem to have nothing to benefit the consumer. Consumers buy consoles and games so making a console with only the publisher’s benefit in mind seems short sighted to me.

 

Not Related: How do I get an forum picture? Thanks!

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Uncharted Territory
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

Jun 9, 2013
Some of you need to feel free to visit my thread.

http://community.us.playstation.com/t5/PlayStation-General/With-all-this-talk-of-DRM-amp-GS-I-have-o...
"While we're being honest, might I suggest something.

Please put your trophy profile as private, otherwise I might have believed you own a PS4 (thanks for the fake pic though)."


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Hekseville Citizen
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

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Jun 9, 2013

Mayhem1421 wrote:

Cars and software are apples to oranges, devs have every right to charge if software changes hands. You buy a new game for $50 play it get bored give it to a friend who plays it for a year, you don't see a problem? Sorry but your friend needs to pay for it. Why do you need to lends friends games? If they want a game let them buy it.  Not trying to be a **bleep** but it's just the right thing to do.


What experience does anyone here have in busniess or the game industry how many of you are actually Americans. Gawd it sounds like you guys are GOP's or something. What other indusrties are allowed without goverment mandate to prohibit used sales of their products.

SIck of the responses to car vs. game debate it about ownership which soon we will have none with physical games retail games. I am done let the world burn Skidrow comes comes to consoles lol I am a game designer.

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VP of Gaming
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

[ Edited ]
Jun 9, 2013

balmungfury wrote:

Mayhem1421 wrote:

Cars and software are apples to oranges, devs have every right to charge if software changes hands. You buy a new game for $50 play it get bored give it to a friend who plays it for a year, you don't see a problem? Sorry but your friend needs to pay for it. Why do you need to lends friends games? If they want a game let them buy it.  Not trying to be a **bleep** but it's just the right thing to do.


What experience does anyone here have in busniess or the game industry how many of you are actually Americans. Gawd it sounds like you guys are GOP's or something. What other indusrties are allowed without goverment mandate to prohibit used sales of their products.

SIck of the responses to car vs. game debate it about ownership which soon we will have none with physical games retail games. I am done let the world burn Skidrow comes comes to consoles lol I am a game designer.


100% Made in the USA!! Here's the thing, they aren't "prohibiting the sale of used games", and there's no law against what they are doing. A better analogy would be cell phones. You are allowed to buy a used cell phone, however you will still have to activate it to sign on to Verizon's network.

 

You are accessing the developers servers when you buy a used game, even if you're just downloading updates. Somebody has to pay for it. Again, the nature of the business has changed over the last ten years. Support has gone from zero to now YEARS, and someone has to pay the people who do the work related to it.

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Hekseville Citizen
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

Jun 9, 2013
But microsoft owns the servers thats how they are able to charge for it I asked Namco about this because the online passes do not work when XBLG is expired even though you buy access to them double dipping fees on consumers. It is all a crock of bleeding Makoto nuts.
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VP of Gaming
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

Jun 9, 2013

balmungfury wrote:
But microsoft owns the servers thats how they are able to charge for it I asked Namco about this because the online passes do not work when XBLG is expired even though you buy access to them double dipping fees on consumers. It is all a crock of bleeding Makoto nuts.

From what I know Microsoft doesn't "own" the servers. Live is a central network, and the individual developers connect their servers to it.

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Monster Hunter
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Re: Is PS4 has DRM, will you Dip?

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Jun 9, 2013

I agree with the servers being an issue that must be paid for. The online pass is not a problem in my opinion when it has to do with online play. The problem comes in when an entirely offline single player game is getting junk tacked on just to justify online play. I have no issue with Microsoft charging used game buyers an extra fee to access the multiplayer servers. These servers are constantly updated and worked on so it is only natural everyone using them pays for them. If you purchase a used game to play on these servers you owe maintenance money.

 

A game like Skyrim is played totally offline and should not be hampered by an online pass or other such DRM. Of course Skyrim opens up the issue of pricing. Should all games be universally charging $60? My opinion is no. Skyrim and other such games could easily justify a $100 price tag while other games can’t justify a $30 price tag. It’s the one size fits all DRM approach that I find so troubling.

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