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Fender Bender
Registered: 01/04/2006
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

DuoMaxwell007 wrote:
I was wondering how/wher ethis rumor that the PS3 would have an update that would give it BC again came from? I mean it make sno logical sense. Why would Sony remove backwards compatibility only to have an update later on that would give it back? If they wer egonna give it back then why take it in the first place?


Ps2 still sells very well. If I was to hazard a guess, we will see an influx of ps1 titles for psp/ps3 first. Depending on the end of life Sony has determined for the ps2, there may be a slim chance of software ps2 on the ps3, but I would reason its more likely to be a part of the Next full PS console iteration instead. Personally I prefer the GOW collection approach. Re skin the ps2 titles that are the big sellers for Hd on the Ps3 instead. That way you don't cannabilize the potential ps2 console sales, but the Non BC owning ps3 owners can have the option of buying the up rezzed version if they want.
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Splicer
Registered: 12/08/2004
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

Once they release the firmware update that includes the PS2 emulator, all consoles will be able to play disc based PS2 games and download games via the PSN...look for this as a possible premium service soon...

It is cheaper for Sony to move to a software based emu over the hardware based system they previous used because of the problems with the hardware based playback, it was far from error free, and dealing with software allows them to make a more robust emu.  All models of the PS3 still have the PS2 memory card utility in the XMB, this is not left over code from when there was hadware based BC, it would have been easy enough to disable this feature for all models that do not have the hardware to play the games.  Think about it.  Sony filed for a patent this year which describes EE PS2 (emotion engine) code being emulated by a Cell processor (PS3) (EmotionEngineEmulationTechnologyForCellProcessor) , Segas released (leaked) memo, the ability to still create PS2 memory blocks for saving games and the market value in doing so.  Yes, PS2 games re-released in HD is nice, but who wouldnt like to sit down and play something the way they remember it.

 

I have NO DOUBT that PS2 and Dreamcast games will be available within the 2010 year on the PSN.

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Sackboy
Registered: 05/31/2009
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

I don't think they're going to link the downloads/emulation thing to the premium service. No-one is going to pay every month for BC when others don't have to. Buying a game or whatever is a one time deal, not a lasting feature of course. I could see them possibly including XGC in the service although I hope they don't. One possible scenario is you have to actually BUY the emulator but this whole situation is a little too foggy right now to wrap your brain around.

 

 

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Lombax Warrior
Registered: 08/03/2007
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

lock67ca wrote:
They had to but the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.

 

Not the EE - but the GS.  

 

The original PS3s had a hardware PS2 EE/GS chipset.  The second generation PS3s had the EE in software via the Cell - which is what that patent is describing - but the GS was still in hardware.   

 

When they removed the GS, they lost PS2 BC - as simple as that.  So far, Sony hasn't been able to emulate the GS with the Cell or the RSX.  

 

I have more info about that here:

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&message.id=65971#M6597...

 

Cheers,

Paul 

 

 

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Sackboy
Registered: 05/31/2009
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

weasel_bot wrote:

lock67ca wrote:
They had to but the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.

 

Not the EE - but the GS.  

 

The original PS3s had a hardware PS2 EE/GS chipset.  The second generation PS3s had the EE in software via the Cell - which is what that patent is describing - but the GS was still in hardware.   

 

When they removed the GS, they lost PS2 BC - as simple as that.  So far, Sony hasn't been able to emulate the GS with the Cell or the RSX.  

 

I have more info about that here:

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&message.id=65971#M6597...

 

Cheers,

Paul 

 

 


The second patent that surfaced was about emulating the GS. Sony stated they have gotten SOME games to work via 100% emulation but not all. It's probably just relates to them getting some games on the store in the near future. Who knows.

 

 

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Fender Bender
Registered: 06/20/2009
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 16, 2009

biggie86205 wrote:
They took it away to cut costs, and I agree, its not coming back. It would make no sense as they are releasing ps1 titles for download in the ps store anyways..
all PS3 models can play PS1 discs.  it's PS2 that requires B/C. 

 

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Hekseville Citizen
Registered: 08/23/2009
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 17, 2009
They had to put the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.
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Hekseville Citizen
Registered: 06/07/2008
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 17, 2009

Hitthelights2287 wrote:

weasel_bot wrote:

lock67ca wrote:
They had to but the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.

 

Not the EE - but the GS.  

 

The original PS3s had a hardware PS2 EE/GS chipset.  The second generation PS3s had the EE in software via the Cell - which is what that patent is describing - but the GS was still in hardware.   

 

When they removed the GS, they lost PS2 BC - as simple as that.  So far, Sony hasn't been able to emulate the GS with the Cell or the RSX.  

 

I have more info about that here:

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&message.id=65971#M6597...

 

Cheers,

Paul 

 

 


The second patent that surfaced was about emulating the GS. Sony stated they have gotten SOME games to work via 100% emulation but not all. It's probably just relates to them getting some games on the store in the near future. Who knows.

 

 


Can you provide a link to that second patent?

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Hekseville Citizen
Registered: 06/07/2008
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 17, 2009

weasel_bot wrote:

lock67ca wrote:
They had to but the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.

 

Not the EE - but the GS.  

 

The original PS3s had a hardware PS2 EE/GS chipset.  The second generation PS3s had the EE in software via the Cell - which is what that patent is describing - but the GS was still in hardware.   

 

When they removed the GS, they lost PS2 BC - as simple as that.  So far, Sony hasn't been able to emulate the GS with the Cell or the RSX.  

 

I have more info about that here:

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&message.id=65971#M6597...

 

Cheers,

Paul 

 

 


Paul,

Kudos for the info. But that Japanese article seems to be from 2007. And there are just too many substantial rumors that suggests they might have worked out a solution that fully emulates the GS as well as make improvements to the emulation of the EE. I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just keeping an open mind and hoping that this is true as there are many PS2 games that I didn't get around to play before I regretfully traded my PS2 in. Even though the Japanese article/post is convincing that there is no possible solution, it has been around three years since then, so I think if SONY had a small group of brilliant minds working on the problem since then, they probably would have solved it by now and are just working out the small things. Be curious to hear what you think.

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Sackboy
Registered: 05/31/2009
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Re: Software update with BC rumors?

Dec 17, 2009

JAM_GAM wrote:

Hitthelights2287 wrote:

weasel_bot wrote:

lock67ca wrote:
They had to but the PS2 Emotion Engine into the PS3 for b/c, which drove up the cost. But, correct me if I'm wrong, software emulation could be handled with a firmware update, which wouldn't add any cost to the PS3 at all.

 

Not the EE - but the GS.  

 

The original PS3s had a hardware PS2 EE/GS chipset.  The second generation PS3s had the EE in software via the Cell - which is what that patent is describing - but the GS was still in hardware.   

 

When they removed the GS, they lost PS2 BC - as simple as that.  So far, Sony hasn't been able to emulate the GS with the Cell or the RSX.  

 

I have more info about that here:

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3updates&message.id=65971#M6597...

 

Cheers,

Paul 

 

 


The second patent that surfaced was about emulating the GS. Sony stated they have gotten SOME games to work via 100% emulation but not all. It's probably just relates to them getting some games on the store in the near future. Who knows.

 

 


Can you provide a link to that second patent?


http://scrawlfx.com/2009/08/sony-files-patent-for-graphics-synthesizer-emulation

 

 

...But it's from 2007, so they could have canned it.

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