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First Son
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013

You are correct. All this integration with social media is apalling to even consider in a new console, and insulting to the consumers. The fact is most of these "features" are software based. Which means you'll be buying a Disc Drive less PS3 with a new firmware. 

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Ghost of Sparta
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

[ Edited ]
Feb 21, 2013

InfinityCG wrote:

From what I've been able to gather so far from the really vague information that's been given, I am afraid for the PlayStation's future.  Several reasons for this:

1.  No disc drive? Rumors are not your ally; the specs Sony released included a Blu-Ray drive.  Download only? Disproved.  This basically screws everyone that has been a PS fan since the beginning.  First of all, I own lots of PS1 games.  I want to just be able to pop one in and play if I feel like it.  I'd be willing to shell out a few extra bucks for that capability. At no time during the press conference did they say that PS1 games wouldn't work in a PS4.  Instead, they're going to offer PSN downloads of POPULAR games (have a niche title you love but is not in the download list on PSN?  Sorry for your luck.)  Second and worst of all, if I want to play FFVII or Metal Gear Solid, I have to BUY THE DOWNLOAD even though I already have the game sitting over here on my shelf?  Where is the payback for those of us who have been loyal to Sony since the start?  I bought my first PS back in 96 with my very first income tax return check from my dishwashing job at 17 years old, and have never played anything else but a Sony console since.  I waited in line at 3 in the morning for the PS2, went through the disc read error crap with 2 different consoles, and have never even thought about buying a Nintendo or Microsoft.  Is this how you repay your fans? 

 

2.  This thing with the downloadable games brings up another problem, even with a TB hard drive, you could only have a limited amount of content on your console at any one time before you would have to go thru and decide what to delete so you can download something else. That is the way it is with current consoles. No one is complaining, that is unless you're typing this under the assumption there will be no optical drive. And then what if you want to play what you downloaded before again?  I'm sure it won't be infinitely downloadable as many times as you want. How are you sure? Is this witchcraft or soccery? What's going to happen to used games?  That's obvious. No, no it is not. The patent, I'm assuming that is what you're basing this wild accusation on, doesn't need to be used.  I'm sorry Sony, but some games are good enough to warrant a buy and play for a few weeks, but not shelling out 60 bucks for. How about the handy dandy feature of trying the game before you purchase it, as mentioned in the conference.  Only the true classics are worth that, and let's face it, innovation is slowly but surely grounding to a halt.  Skylanders is honestly the most innovative thing that has come out in years.  Everything else is just (Insert franchise name here) 2, 3, 4, (insert gimmicky extra title here, ex. Assassin's Creed Brotherhood, etc.)...fresh ideas are running out.  We need to be able to have other options.  Forcing us to do things your way or the highway is a recipe for failure. Nothing to do with the console.

 

3.  What happens when the hard drive inevitably fails? Just going off PS3's HDD failure isn't that common a problem. What about network failures that could possibly corrupt streaming content or online game saves? These are problems that can exist already, how will this make the PS4 fail colassally?  What's the backup plan for this?  Hope you guys learned your lesson from the PSN debacle. 

 

4.  When one of the "groundbreaking" features is a partnership with Facebook, that's legitimate reason to worry.  Anyone remember MySpace?  Social networking sites come and go, and anybody that uses FB I'm sure can see the similarities in MS starting to pop up:  people whining and crying and moaning too much, WAAAAY too much sharing of photos and music videos and crap like that, FB is ROCKETING downhill...in short, it's not going to be around forever.  (I would be willing to bet a max of 1-2 more years.) How will this spell disaster for a game console if no one chooses to use a social network. The PS4 will not be sybiotically dependent on social media. 

 

5.  Another "groundbreaking" feature is the sharing of gameplay footage?  I could care less about this. I don't care about the ability to stream media to my PS3, doesn't mean anything. Maybe some people do, but this should be a niche detail feature, not one of the consoles major selling points. How does an addition spell disaster?  That concerns me.  I just cannot picture many people in todays rushing world sitting down in front of their $500 gaming machine to watch what their friends did earlier in their game.  That's what YouTube is for. I didn't know that YouTube allowed us to record gameplay footage. It lets us upload and share it.

 

6.  Other features are just rehashes of stuff that was released in this gen.  PS4+PSVita basically= WiiU. Of course I can take my WiiU controller on the bus and play there. Oh wait wasn't remoteplay on the PSP, that happened before the Wii U right? motion sensors, been there done that, Is it supposed to be taken out because of it.is ok at times WITH friends, but that's about it.  If they're going to go this route, it needs to go a step further and do a Kinect type "your body IS the controller" feature BUILT IN, not an extra you have to pay for.  

 

7.  Believe it or not, there are still plenty of people out there who either live in areas that do not have suitable gaming quality internet (or no internet at all) or can't afford it, and it seems that the move is finally being made to basically disregard the single player experience in favor of online net gaming.  This is going to eliminate a lot of buyers who simply don't have the means to do it, even if they want to. Difference between then and now? None. It will not cripple a console because most people do have internet.

 

8.  Sony's strategy is seemingly counting on the people that buy this console are absolute gaming freaks who live and breathe games and don't do anything else in their spare time I thought social media and extra features were a crime(not to mention spend time with the wife/gf/bf/husband/kids/go out with friends on Friday night, etc.)...also, that everyone has large amounts of friends who are gaming freaks AND have the console as well.  In today's world, the average adult just doesn't have the time to invest this much money in something that seemingly assumes we have a lot more spare time than we do when you throw in full time jobs, college, family time, etc. and those that have the spare time probably don't have the money (kids). How is the PS4 different from the PS3 in this respect? Nonsense.

 

9.  I personally DO NOT WANT my PS to download stuff for me it THINKS I will like.  This is kind of like the "buy something, we'll keep sending it to you until you cancel" thing that annoys the heck out of me in the real world.  This "feature" better be able to be turned off. That's it, the console crippling flaw!

 

This and other smaller details that I'm sure will come out later (These concerns are just my "off the top of my head" FIRST IMPRESSIONS) have me very nervous about the next gen, this could possibly be the end of the line if it fails, and Sony seems to be willing to make some huge gambles here.  It's been a fun ride so far, but I must say with us already fast approaching the end of February and the console set to debut at the end of this year, Sony seriously needs to go in detail about this thing and set our minds at ease about our concerns.  Let's face it, the economy sucks and most of us just don't have mountains of money to blow on video games anymore. They're going to have to prove to me it's going to be worth it to basically start all over from scratch like the first 3 Playstations basically never existed and be at the top of their game right out of the gate.  Here's hoping it goes well, but I'm being VERY cautiously optimistic.


 Putting your concerns at ease since 2008: Link to interview regarding used games

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Fabulous!
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Fender Bender
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013

While I disagree with how Sony decided to just release essentially what is a teaser to me, in my eyes there is no way online stream like onlive should make the feature list.  Believe it or not, Sony should have the most basic idea of how to keep gamers gaming.  Online access requirement for games would make it a colossal failure. 

 

I think E3 would be the best bet to get some reassurance. 


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Survivor
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013
It seems you are basing all these assumptions on false information or outdated rumors. Dark has pretty much debunked the false rumors for you.

Instead I think that you should update yourself on what was said in the presentation, the official released specs, and then review all the information. And if you want to comment on rumors, you should remember that they are rumors and not take them as the truth.

Personally, I'm holding judgement until more information is released.
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Fender Bender
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Re: Do you have your money saved already for the PS4??

Feb 21, 2013

Nah. I won't be getting it at launch. Still have way too many unfinished games on PS3.







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Uncharted Territory
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Re: Do you have your money saved already for the PS4??

Feb 21, 2013
Still depends on launch titles. Killzone and inFamous aren't system sellers for me.
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Welcoming Committee
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013

InfinityCG wrote:

From what I've been able to gather so far from the really vague information that's been given, I am afraid for the PlayStation's future.  Several reasons for this:

1.  No disc drive?  Download only?  This basically screws everyone that has been a PS fan since the beginning.  First of all, I own lots of PS1 games.  I want to just be able to pop one in and play if I feel like it.  I'd be willing to shell out a few extra bucks for that capability.  Instead, they're going to offer PSN downloads of POPULAR games (have a niche title you love but is not in the download list on PSN?  Sorry for your luck.)  Second and worst of all, if I want to play FFVII or Metal Gear Solid, I have to BUY THE DOWNLOAD even though I already have the game sitting over here on my shelf?  Where is the payback for those of us who have been loyal to Sony since the start?  I bought my first PS back in 96 with my very first income tax return check from my dishwashing job at 17 years old, and have never played anything else but a Sony console since.  I waited in line at 3 in the morning for the PS2, went through the disc read error crap with 2 different consoles, and have never even thought about buying a Nintendo or Microsoft.  Is this how you repay your fans?

 

This would be horrible.  I've already said it.

 

2.  This thing with the downloadable games brings up another problem, even with a TB hard drive, you could only have a limited amount of content on your console at any one time before you would have to go thru and decide what to delete so you can download something else.  And then what if you want to play what you downloaded before again?  I'm sure it won't be infinitely downloadable as many times as you want.  What's going to happen to used games?  That's obvious.  I'm sorry Sony, but some games are good enough to warrant a buy and play for a few weeks, but not shelling out 60 bucks for.  Only the true classics are worth that, and let's face it, innovation is slowly but surely grounding to a halt.  Skylanders is honestly the most innovative thing that has come out in years.  Everything else is just (Insert franchise name here) 2, 3, 4, (insert gimmicky extra title here, ex. Assassin's Creed Brotherhood, etc.)...fresh ideas are running out.  We need to be able to have other options.  Forcing us to do things your way or the highway is a recipe for failure.

 

They figure it's easier to make space on your hard drive than space in your apartment for all those games.

 

3.  What happens when the hard drive inevitably fails?  What about network failures that could possibly corrupt streaming content or online game saves?  What's the backup plan for this?  Hope you guys learned your lesson from the PSN debacle.

 

This could make or break the whole project.  If I have dl only, I need to know my stuff is secure.  If they replace the hard drive for me as well as all the games and all the saves, it will be fine.  If they basically laugh and say that's my problem, then we have fail.

 

4.  When one of the "groundbreaking" features is a partnership with Facebook, that's legitimate reason to worry.  Anyone remember MySpace?  Social networking sites come and go, and anybody that uses FB I'm sure can see the similarities in MS starting to pop up:  people whining and crying and moaning too much, WAAAAY too much sharing of photos and music videos and crap like that, FB is ROCKETING downhill...in short, it's not going to be around forever.  (I would be willing to bet a max of 1-2 more years.)

 

Anyone remember JIVE?  The whole forum was set up like a FB/Myspace deal and it was a ghost town.  They finally went back to Lithium and this forum is coming back to life.  I remember the reaction from the Euro playstation forums.  They saw what Jive was doing and wisely decided to keep Lithium.  Such a bad idea.  I'd go so far as to say the worst idea ever enacted at this forum.

 

5.  Another "groundbreaking" feature is the sharing of gameplay footage?  I could care less about this.  Maybe some people do, but this should be a niche detail feature, not one of the consoles major selling points.  That concerns me.  I just cannot picture many people in todays rushing world sitting down in front of their $500 gaming machine to watch what their friends did earlier in their game.  That's what YouTube is for.

 

It's the modern equivalent of going to someone's house and watching a slideshow of their vacation.  Nobody wants this.  Really bad idea.  It would be good only for the most hardcore of gamers, to look for flaws in their strategies.  Kinda like football players watching tapes of their last game to look for flaws.  But now it's more like work than a game.  Too much like work, literally.

 

6.  Other features are just rehashes of stuff that was released in this gen.  PS4+PSVita basically= WiiU...motion sensors, been there done that, is ok at times WITH friends, but that's about it.  If they're going to go this route, it needs to go a step further and do a Kinect type "your body IS the controller" feature BUILT IN, not an extra you have to pay for.  

 

I for one don't want to run around the room like I'm trapped in the game.  I just want to sit there and let the guy in the game do all the work.

 

7.  Believe it or not, there are still plenty of people out there who either live in areas that do not have suitable gaming quality internet (or no internet at all) or can't afford it, and it seems that the move is finally being made to basically disregard the single player experience in favor of online net gaming.  This is going to eliminate a lot of buyers who simply don't have the means to do it, even if they want to.

 

Without a single-player mode, there is no objective way to win.  Think about someone who said they bowled a 275 at the bowling alley.  That's pretty good no matter who you are.  But then someone else said they were playing football and they won with a score of 97-0.  I have to ask who they were playing against.  Girl Scouts maybe?  If you beat the game in single-player mode, it is an objective accomplishment that can't be disputed.  But if you beat some guys online, they might have been worthless.

 

8.  Sony's strategy is seemingly counting on the people that buy this console are absolute gaming freaks who live and breathe games and don't do anything else in their spare time (not to mention spend time with the wife/gf/bf/husband/kids/go out with friends on Friday night, etc.)...also, that everyone has large amounts of friends who are gaming freaks AND have the console as well.  In today's world, the average adult just doesn't have the time to invest this much money in something that seemingly assumes we have a lot more spare time than we do when you throw in full time jobs, college, family time, etc. and those that have the spare time probably don't have the money (kids).

 

This level of devotion goes past multi-tasking and back to uni-tasking (my word).  In today's world it gets harder and harder to sit down and concentrate on doing one thing at a time.  People need a game they can play while surfing the net, watching TV, talking on the phone, texting on another phone, and holding two irl conversations at the same time.  It's already to the point where some people I know can't watch a movie.  Just sit down and watch the movie.  But they're on the phone, cooking dinner, doing the laundry, playing with the dog, surfing, emailing, vacuuming the carpet, and basically doing everything except watching the movie they wanted to watch.

 

9.  I personally DO NOT WANT my PS to download stuff for me it THINKS I will like.  This is kind of like the "buy something, we'll keep sending it to you until you cancel" thing that annoys the heck out of me in the real world.  This "feature" better be able to be turned off.

 

Definitely not.  Especially after the whole Jive debacle, I have no faith in Sony predicting what I nor anybody else wants.

 

This and other smaller details that I'm sure will come out later (These concerns are just my "off the top of my head" FIRST IMPRESSIONS) have me very nervous about the next gen, this could possibly be the end of the line if it fails, and Sony seems to be willing to make some huge gambles here.  It's been a fun ride so far, but I must say with us already fast approaching the end of February and the console set to debut at the end of this year, Sony seriously needs to go in detail about this thing and set our minds at ease about our concerns.  Let's face it, the economy sucks and most of us just don't have mountains of money to blow on video games anymore.  They're going to have to prove to me it's going to be worth it to basically start all over from scratch like the first 3 Playstations basically never existed and be at the top of their game right out of the gate.  Here's hoping it goes well, but I'm being VERY cautiously optimistic.

 

In a bad economy, where nobody has a mountain of money to spend on games, the key to success is backwards compatibility.  Would it cost that much to have an on-die PS2/PS3 emulator chip?  Make the thing 100% backwards compatible back to the PS2.  Forget the PS1 games.  You gotta draw the line somewhere.


The thing to remember here is that whatever Sony is going to sell as a PS4 has already been designed and tested.  It's far too late in the day for them to accept inputs like these or any form of constructive criticism.  If they are headed for fail, then there is no steering the ship away from the iceberg.

 

I too am expecting fail.  Sony hasn't exactly wowed me lately with their wonderful products or brilliant marketing strategies.  They will push whatever they make out to the market and expect you to buy it because it's a Sony.  You might as well call them the WeSaySo Corporation.

 

Wouldn't it be hilarious if Apple joined the console wars?

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Hekseville Citizen
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013

This is like how people keep saying Call of Duty games will fail, yet they dominate sales. While the PS4 may not dominate, it won't fail. Just judging by the forums here, the majority of people can't wait. The people that don't seem to like what they've seen also happen to be the Google warriors who down everyone's opinion on here. Good riddance I say, you won't be missed by me.

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Treasure Hunter
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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

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Feb 21, 2013

I'm not getting it because of the freeze issue and just because it has a certain number on it consoles, doesn't impress me!

They have trouble maintaining this one and certain issues went on far too long!
(Freeze).

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Re: PS4 Setting up to be most colossal fail ever

Feb 21, 2013

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