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Lombax Warrior
Registered: 06/07/2013
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Re: The Death Penalty

Jul 21, 2013

Well with the trigger option only one out of twenty people has the bullet so no one will know who shot the person. They can either live with thinking they were the one with the bullet or that it was someone else.

"There is no land for us beyond the Volga"~ Vassili Zaitsev
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Welcoming Committee
Registered: 10/02/2008
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Re: The Death Penalty

Jul 21, 2013

gmeans98 wrote:

Well with the trigger option only one out of twenty people has the bullet so no one will know who shot the person. They can either live with thinking they were the one with the bullet or that it was someone else.


That is a horrible way to rationalize it. 

 

"You might have not killed him! Best of luck until the next one!"

 

The question that may haunt you is "What if I did it!?"


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Fender Bender
Registered: 12/30/2011
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Re: The Death Penalty

Jul 21, 2013

Setzaroth wrote:

KZMProductionsGT wrote:

lol death penalty is stupid

 

and flame me, i dont even think the worst offenders (rapists, serial killers, peodphiles) deserve it. it doesnt bring any victims back and they dont even suffer. enjoy your false sense of justice.


LOL

 

Yes, supporting them for life is much better.


One of my majors is nuero science and so I think killing them isnt a good idea because I am indeed very intrigued by their mental makeup

KZMProductionsGT
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: The Death Penalty

Jul 21, 2013

Personally, I'm fine with the Death Penalty so long as the person's guilty can be proven definitively, such as cases in which there are multiple credible eye-witnesses. Cases of innocent people being killed only to be later exonerated are true tragedies and clear evidence of the failings of our legal system. The way I see it, laws exist to protect and maintain a society. If a person would willingly choose to violate those laws by taking the life of another person, then they should be permanently removed from that society.

 

 

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Welcoming Committee
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Re: The Death Penalty

Jul 21, 2013

bob-maul wrote:

This should be an interesting discussion. 

 

I am personally against the death penalty for several reasons. 

 

1. I hate the chance of an innocent person dying when evidence is found just a little while later that proves it was not them. It has happened several times.

But if putting them in prison is worse (see your point #3) then you have done far worse to an innocent person.  In a retrial you're guilty until proven innocent, so it's very hard to get free even if there is solid proof of your innocence.  There have also been some guilty people who got free later by hiring really sharp lawyers.  During President Clinton's last days in office, he was notorious for selling pardons to people like Marc Rich, who had fled the country.  This all must be factored in.

 

And what about the people we know for a fact are guilty?  We caught them in the act (Boston Bomber guy).  They brag openly about how many people they kill and what they would do when they get out.  They admitted to the crime and provided proof that only the real killer would know about.

 

If you were 100% absolutely certain beyond any doubt that this criminal killed someone, would you still be opposed to the death penalty?  Most people I ask this to are still opposed, so this is a weak argument.  It really comes down to your #4 answer, that you don't like the idea of killing anyone ever.  That's all well and good, but someone is going to die.  Either the criminal must die, or his next several victims will.  We as a society make the choice that the guilty must die to prevent the innocent from dying.  This is how it works in the real world.  No, it's not pretty.  But it's a necessity.

 

2. Economically, it makes no sense. The criminal appeals it a thousand times and, by the time he/she is executed, has wasted more state money than if they had kept them locked away,

This cost is artificial, because of the possibility of executing an innocent man.  We as a nation demanded automatic appeals up to the federal circuit court.  We don't have those for life imprisonment, which you claim is worse.  Remove the automatic appeals and it becomes far cheaper to execute someone.  A bullet costs much less than a lifetime of free room and board, with prison guards.  As you say, presently the cost makes no sense.  Simply have it make sense.

 

Also, I feel this "cost to execute" argument is misdirected.  The real cost/benefit analysis is the cost of executing someone versus the cost to society if the criminal ever goes free again.  Some people (Osama bin Laden) are simply too dangerous to be allowed to live.  We have criminals in this country who would just as soon shoot you as say hello.  We don't need them.  Simple people (parrots, sheeple, etc.) often say, "It takes all kinds."

 

OK then.  Hitler.  Do we need another Hitler?  We don't have one now in this country, so it it really does take all kinds, then we desperately need another Hitler right away!  We need someone spreading hatred, lies, crime, and reorganizing society into a populace immobilized by fear.  And we need it NOW!  Right?

 

No, we don't need another Hitler.  It does NOT take all kinds.  Murderous thugs can be deleted from society and we will still function just fine.  Better, actually.

 

3. If you want them to suffer, they should not get a fast path to death. The largest suffering will come from them sitting in a prison for 40 years with nothing but a cold toilet and window. Obviously this may differ from person to person. They may not want to die because prison life is no big deal to them, but I think a boring 40 years in a horrible place is a fine punishment before their death.

If you are in prison, there is always a chance that you might go free again.  Every few years Charles Manson is up for parole.  He never makes parole, but it's possible.  If you're a terrorist, there's always a chance that the other terrorists might kidnap some important figure and try to trade your life for his.  I've seen this work far too many times.  A freed terrorist could equate to thousands of DEFINITELY innocent lives lost as opposed to one POTENTIAL innocent life lost (that of the terrorist).  We let Osama bin Laden go free in 1993 after his first attempt to blow up the WTC.  Wouldn't it have been better to just execute him right then and there?


The fact is, killers do get out of prison and kill again.  I'm not so concerned about torturing the guy by making him spend 40+ years in prison, as I am of making sure he never kills again.  If he's dead, he won't kill again.  Period.  If he's alive, some judge could let him out due to "overcrowding" or whatever and he's killing again.  My thinking is far more geard toward protecting the innocent than torturing the guilty.

 

4. This is my personal reason. I cannot imagine killing a person. I would like to think that I could rationalize it in my mind if they had done a horrible deed, but I would just suffer emotionally if I had to pull the trigger (an injection, rather, but you get my point ).

I wouldn't have a problem with it.  Ask yourself, could you stab someone you don't even know with a knife?  I'm betting the answer is no.  But now what if that person has cancer and you're really cutting into him with a scalpel to save his life?  That's different.  The act is almost identical but the purpose is different.  You're now cutting into him because life is precious and you're doing what you can to save lives.

 

Executing the guilty is much like that.  If you focus solely on the act, it looks like you're murdering the criminal.  But you're not.  You're executing someone guilty to protect the innocent.  You are saving life.  If you won't pull the switch, I will.

 

The thing you must ALWAYS keep in mind is the value of innocent life.  Innocent life must be defended.  Guilty life must be ended.


This is why I am all for the death penalty.

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