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Treasure Hunter
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

The problem I see with GT's aerodynamics is the absence of "dirty air" simulation.  In real racing, when following someone closely, your downforce will decrease, especially in the front, causing understeer. I've never observed this to happen in Gran Turismo, which is kind of disappointing at this iteration...

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Last Guardian
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

Deafting is neither present in game as well... It's a fact if a car drafts behind you then both car increase in speed.... Not so with this "Real driving simulator"

Main complaint is the other cars tires never wear or need fuel

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

to exxboxfan- they are based on a comparison with reality.  as in the example i mentioned, driving in Monza in gt5 i end up having to go with full downforce, which is the opposite of reality (all racing cars of any type drive with low downforce settings in monza.  sometimes some cars try a little bit higher setting, low-medium downforce.. but never highest).

and actually, even in the superspeedway-indy.. i end up with better laps going with a highest or almost highest downforce setting.  with some cars i lap about 0.1 faster with almost full downforce, just a pinch less than full.  might have been just luck, most often i find that i'm lapping faster with full downforce.  with the fgt yea i can put downforce to minimum, it can corner all the 4 turns anyway (havent actually seen if i lap better tho, ill check that next time i'm farming credits).

simply put, the increase in speed given by lowering the downforce is not yielding enough extra speed in the straights... even in these 2 notoriously high speed tracks.

someone mentioned that i would need to also tweak other suspension settings while lowering the downforce; i havent played around too much with that (other than lowering height and stiffening slightly springs as long as car doesn't ''jump'' losing traction) but i hope that's the case cause otherwise this really doesn't make sense to me.  if so, could you please post how you would generally change the suspension settings when lowering downforce please?

As for the tyres, someone mentioned again that it may be because i'm driving the hard tyres like softs, and using them up fast cause then they skid more.. as i said before, that's not the case; i've tried them driving clean without skidding/oversteering.. and they still last about the same as soft.  would i have gone even slower with those hards, i would have lost even more than 1-2 sec / lap; as already mentioned before, the hards seem to be so much slower than the softs that they wouldn't be convenient even if they lasted forever.

The last GT i had played was gt2, so i'm not even considering that as a comparison.. the tyre use was just ridiculously fast there.

my garage: http://www.mygranturismo.net/19932
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Uncharted Territory
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

Sven-RIT wrote:

The problem I see with GT's aerodynamics is the absence of "dirty air" simulation.  In real racing, when following someone closely, your downforce will decrease, especially in the front, causing understeer. I've never observed this to happen in Gran Turismo, which is kind of disappointing at this iteration...

--------------------------

Folding@Home nearly 24/7 since April 2007, over 2500 work units completed. What have you done to cure cancer recently?


actually in online mode we experience dirty air. it really make one have to adjust their turn in and brake points.

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

Well in F1 as per the FIA the teams can put on different iteration of wings. I.E. flat wings. With GT you can only take the given wings to their lowest level which still produces viable down force. The problem comes from not being able to actually change the wings. Currently you can only adjust the angle of the flaps producing the down force.

Consistency.
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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

choochie49 wrote:

Deafting is neither present in game as well... It's a fact if a car drafts behind you then both car increase in speed.... Not so with this "Real driving simulator"

Main complaint is the other cars tires never wear or need fuel

hmmmm... not my observation at all.

Even the karts draft correctly:

max top speed on level terrain alone = 77mph

max top speed on level terrain while drafting = 83mph (both karts)

Tire wear and fuel usage is also part of the game.

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Keyblade Wielder
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

Evil-_-Nox wrote:

I can go 60 MPH faster by turning the downforce to minimum in the x1 as opposed to max.

Your hard tires are probably wearing out at the same rate because you're still driving them as if they are softs.  Everytime they slide and spin they wear out quicker.


that was also my thought about the tires... you have to drive more like the A.I. drive and not push your car if you want the hard tires to last, i'd expect, but I don't really drive that way so I don't know LOL

if you hear any noise when you turn, you are wearing your tires, regardless of whether the color on the temp indicator changes...

aka Ex_Stream_Tuna -FR's & Racing done here. ExXboxfan = Netflix only
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Keyblade Wielder
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

hey6541 wrote:

the  thing that i find really annoying is the cursed over exaggerated draft. there is no way that if a person can get 1 1/2 second lead that the chasing guy should be able to draft him. that is was gets me.


again, is this based on reality, imperical observations, or what you "think" should be true?

Did you ever see the Myth Busters where they tested the reduction in drag from drafting a semi-truck at just 55 mph at various distances?  I know that the slipstream from a large truck is going to be much larger in width and height, but at much slower speeds... so consider a car moving at 150 mph and you can see that the airstream is sucking you forward as you go, not just reducing your draft.

I"m not saying the GT drafting is perfectly realistic, I'm just asking if anyone knows for sure if it is not or just coming to conclusions based on guessing...

aka Ex_Stream_Tuna -FR's & Racing done here. ExXboxfan = Netflix only
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Treasure Hunter
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

hey6541 wrote:

actually in online mode we experience dirty air. it really make one have to adjust their turn in and brake points.

Really? That's good to hear. I haven't played online much, and I would hope that the effect is also in offline mode, but I can't say I've really noticed it. Maybe it's too subtle. Or maybe I don't spend enough time behind the AI...

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Lombax Warrior
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Re: Downforce - flawed? Hard tyres vs. Soft tyres- flawed too?

Feb 9, 2011

exXboxFan wrote:

Evil-_-Nox wrote:

I can go 60 MPH faster by turning the downforce to minimum in the x1 as opposed to max.

Your hard tires are probably wearing out at the same rate because you're still driving them as if they are softs.  Everytime they slide and spin they wear out quicker.


that was also my thought about the tires... you have to drive more like the A.I. drive and not push your car if you want the hard tires to last, i'd expect, but I don't really drive that way so I don't know LOL

if you hear any noise when you turn, you are wearing your tires, regardless of whether the color on the temp indicator changes...

Again, I am saying in my experience this isn't case.  I am following proper driving lines and not going into corners too fast (most of the time).  However, let's just say for the sake of argument that I do drive somewhat improperly and don't follow proper lines and go into corners too fast.  If that was how I drove with both the soft and hard tires, then logic would say that the soft tires would burn out faster just like the hard tires would, correct?

Also, just so everyone is clear, I'm not complaining about the downforce or the tires being flawed.  I didn't create this thread.  The OP posted his observations about these two areas of the game and I have posted my observations.

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